The Penis Podcast Episode 2 | Follow on Spotify | Follow on Apple iTunes
DR GAV: Welcome to The Penis Show, we’re here to just have a casual chat about some really interesting topics and questions surrounding the penis. But initially, Jayson I just wanted to ask you, why non-surgical penis augmentation? How did how did you create CALIBRE Clinic?
DR JAYSON: Thanks Dr Gav, so it’s an interesting sort of story that I just had a few guys saying to me, look, you’ve got all these things you can do for women, you’ve got injections, you don’t have to have surgery anymore, do you have anything for me, to make my penis bigger? So it was sort of intriguing, and with the ability to search online for scientific publications, I was able to find that the Koreans had been doing it for a while. I tried to get in contact with the Koreans, but I never could quite get in contact with them. Then an Italian surgeon published a paper with a video, I saw this video and paper and thought it’s clear that this doctor is a urologist. So he is a surgeon trained in bladder surgery, penis surgery and kidney surgery, but not in cosmetic injectables like we are. I thought that this procedure could be done a whole lot better, and so after several years of research and planning, and especially trying to make sure that anything that we did was really safe (because safety was the number one concern when doing something that is really so new) came up with a series of improvements and then just hunted around for guys to have it. It’s a bit strange going to your friends saying “look, can I inject lip filler into your penis?”, but eventually found enough guys, and we went really slow. So, in the first 12 months, I did like three guys and just sat and waited to see what would happen… and no penises dropped off which was like the first criteria.
DR GAV: Excellent.
DR JAYSON: And yeah, that’s good and they were really happy. The interesting thing about it was, I was expecting it to be a locker room procedure, it’s a confidence thing and that’s why our logo about confidence is so important – Confidence Is Everything. So I was expecting guys to be confident in the locker room, but then I had guys coming back and saying “and my wife really notices it, too!” I hadn’t really expected that. Then the worry was, it wasn’t going last long enough, because when we put the filler in the lips, it may be gone in 12 months. Fortunately, over time the fillers had been getting better and better and then we were finding that in different places, fillers last different times. Fortunately for us, in the penis, it lasts much longer than that same filler would last in the cheeks, and so we were getting guys who were lasting two or three years and even then not having it all disappear. So it was doing a good job, it was making a good increase, and we were talking about an increase in size; an inch is what I expect for your average sort of patient. A bit strange, but the average penis is about nine and a half centimetres in circumference, so it’s about so big, when you increase it by an inch, it’s now that big.
DR GAV: And difficult to imagine the increase when you’re just talking about centimetres or inches until you show someone.
DR JAYSON: Yeah and then they go, “oh, okay, yes, that’s a difference”. So, guys were starting to find that this was a really worthwhile thing, and of course, the difficulty then was that nobody knew that it existed and that’s sort of I guess when you came in, because I’m over here in Perth, Western Australia. We couldn’t be more isolated, an now one of the most isolated places in the world. So guys, we’re obviously recording this during the Coronavirus pandemic and Western Australia has its hard borders. Even if you wanted to come here from Sydney, you couldn’t. So yeah, then we wanted to bring it to Sydney, and that’s how we got you involved.
DR GAV: And look, when did all that process begin Jayson? Just how long ago did you start thinking about the procedure, researching and testing of your first clients?
DR JAYSON: When I first had the idea was like 2010.
DR GAV: Right, that long ago.
DR JAYSON: Like a full decade now, and then 2012, 2013, we had the papers, done the research and the very first treatments were like January 2014. I think it was probably two years later before we got you trained up in Sydney.
DR GAV: Exactly, yeah. Okay, so really I came along a good six years after the initial conception in your mind.
DR JAYSON: Yeah and it wasn’t something we wanted to rush into. My practice as you know, my original training, is in facial plastic surgery and so my work is face lifts, nose jobs, eyelids, wrinkle relaxers and fillers. I’ve got a big practice here, so this this was really branching out and we were sort of thinking, you know, you could ruin a really good successful practice if you have one dick drop off. So there was a big worry of how do you make it safe? Why aren’t people doing this procedure? Is it something that just doesn’t work? And so that’s why I introduced using a cannula. When we first started injecting fillers, we were mostly using needles.
DR GAV: Yes, talking about the face, just needles straight into the face.
DR JAYSON: So needles into the lips and into the cheeks and that sort of thing. Then maybe around a decade ago, we started getting Cannulas. So a cannula is like a needle, as you know, but with a blunt sort of tip. You need to poke a hole in the skin, to get under the skin, and then the cannula slides underneath the skin very easily. It has that advantage of the safety of not poking into blood vessels and nerves and things that you don’t want it to. That was like really important. I didn’t want to be poking sharp needles around if we could avoid it, so that we didn’t poke into things that we that we didn’t want to.
DR GAV: Exactly.
DR JAYSON: Fortunately, there’s that layer in the skin between the superficial and the deep fascia, the layers of structure in there where there’s a glide plain and that cannula runs very nicely in there. You can deposit the filler and you don’t need to have a sharp needle to do it.
DR GAV: Exactly, and with a lot of experience using cannula in the face, it’s a very similar kind of technique and feeling of doing the procedure in the penis, even though it’s at the opposite end of the body. It really is a similar skill, just transferring that skill and understanding how it works in the penis.
DR JAYSON: And that’s why I thought that we had sort of that advantage being cosmetic injectors as opposed to say, a urologist who’s an expert in surgery in the area, but has maybe never done a cosmetic injection. When I was looking for somebody to train and expand CALIBRE into more areas, I was looking for somebody who’s a cosmetic physician, somebody who’s experienced in doing cosmetic injections like you.
DR GAV: Yes. And I became your fellow dick doctor, as they call me.
DR JAYSON: Yes. It’s funny how your career goes. I never expected that dicks were going to be such a big part of my professional life.
DR GAV: I’m sure you didn’t. A practice bursting with patients for facial aesthetics, facelifts as you said, and coming from an ear nose and throat background, it’s a big change. How have you found that? How have you found the process of now being involved in a completely different area with men, when previously we were traditionally involved with doing a lot of work with women?
DR JAYSON: So I was consulting a guy for CALIBRE (CALIBRE is the name that we tend to use for the procedures) just this morning, and obviously for him, he’s never been anywhere and been talking about his penis with another man. Like, as you’re so familiar, guys are so embarrassed, they are reticent to talk about it. They’ve got all these things they want to say, and often then once they do start, you get this tumbling out of everything that they’ve thought about their penis for the last 20, 30 or more years. And yet when I started, I was nervous you know, I didn’t have a huge experience in handling other men’s penises, and now of course, you just say drop your pants. To us, it’s just another body part. And guess what guys – it is just another body part. But I guess the same sort of thing sort of goes if we’re happy to do a nose job, to do a boob job or something, is there any reason why it isn’t just as reasonable to do a penis augmentation?
DR GAV: That’s right, and I guess having created this new procedure and working with these guys, the reasoning behind it, surely it’s a very similar reason for all the other improvements that people are making in cosmetic medicine and aesthetic surgery.
DR JAYSON: It is, it’s basically that same underlying sort of issue and has to do with self-confidence and feeling comfortable in your body and as you know, we’ve been working with psychologists and writing papers on this for a long time now (click here to view). The psychologists, even the ones that we work with, sort of say, well nobody needs any form of cosmetic surgery and I totally agree with that. I’ve spent twenty five years of my life doing this and none of it is necessary surgery, but people appreciate it, people like it, and as you’re so familiar, they come back to you and are so grateful for what you’ve done and they feel better in themselves.
DR GAV: That’s right. That’s the main thing.
DR JAYSON: It is, and even though so many other people don’t notice what it is. This is the same for, especially face sort of things, you’ve had wrinkle relaxers, you’ve had some filler (maybe it’s not if you’ve now go double D breasts when you had B cups before) but a lot of these things, other people don’t notice, but people in themselves, they feel it and they feel more confident, they feel better about themselves.
For guys, when they present, this is the same thing except they’ve never been able to discuss it, they haven’t been able to talk about it to anybody, not even like people in their family, their partners, anything like this and it’s this repressed concern, I get the feeling is really bad for you. If you’ve got a concern and you can at least discuss it with people, that can help improve it. But if you’re not even allowed to discuss it, then it becomes this issue and it’s always there. I’m sure you get this story so many times – you get a guy who comes back, it’s a couple of months after the procedure and they’re telling you about how they feel more confident in everything in their lives, in their business, in their social sort of interactions – I didn’t expect that, in 2014, when we when we first started doing this.
DR GAV: One hundred percent. Yeah and I have to agree with you, I’ve had the same experience, and I didn’t expect it either. I didn’t expect it to make it make such a change in their lives in the way that they felt in everyday life, even though no one else knew that they had the procedure done. They weren’t going out and putting their hand up and telling other people that I had the procedure done, but they felt different about themselves, they felt great and that was a really nice thing to see. We’ve both been very surprised with the reaction from our clients, saying how it made them feel a lot better within themselves, it’s a nice surprise, it was a really good surprise to get. So that that’s been a bit of a revelation and it has been shown and also been reflected in some of the studies that CALIBRE Clinic has been conducting with yourself Jayson?
DR JAYSON: Yeah, so that was the other thing. When I was researching this a decade ago, there had been a few papers published and then nothing, sort of silence. Since then, I’ve published a number of articles in the Aesthetic Surgery Journals and for two years we’ve been working with Curtin University doing a more in-depth look into the psychology of it. Pre-empting it a bit, but what surprised the psychologist was that the guys that we’re seeing are normal, everyday guys and their penises are normal, everyday penises, and they all want a moderate increase in size. They’re not necessarily looking to be hung like a donkey or something..
DR GAV: They’re not going for a porn star type of career
DR JAYSON: No, the only guys who would want to be like that are the guys who are on the big side to start with and you say you don’t need to do anything because that’s a big dick. I bet they say the same thing to you that bigger is always better.
DR GAV: Yeah.
DR JAYSON: The majority of them, the study seems to be showing normal sized penises, they want to be just a bit on the bigger than average sort of size, and when they are, they’re happy. So that’s been encouraging and we’re just waiting to write that up and get that published. But, yeah, that’s useful because that’s never been shown before, nobody’s ever done a study like that.
DR GAV: That’s fantastic, and it’s great to get some really objective data from what we’ve been doing now for many years. That’s been a really great insight into what’s quite a niche procedure, you’re a niche individual Doctor Jayson Oates, and I’m glad that I met you in serendipity 2016 I think it was, and trained me up in this procedure and it’s been a success story I think ever since. I’m really looking forward to talking more about penises, it’s a topic that we don’t get to discuss as males that much in the open, as you said and I have a general practice background and even my patients, my male patients don’t really talk to me much about the penis. I think it’s just one of those things that guys don’t like to talk about, they may want to talk to their friends or their doctor or something about their penis, but we’ve opened up that conversation and guys, once they decide they are comfortable talking to us about it, there’s a lot to say. So I’m really looking forward to doing a few more of these shows with you Jayson, to talk more about some of the findings we’ve made, and some of the things we’ve seen with the procedure, things that work well, things that don’t, even topics such as erectile dysfunction, how that plays out, some of the psychology behind it and some of the types of patients we’ve seen and their experiences, so I’m really looking forward to it.
DR JAYSON: Yeah, there is so much to talk about here and we’ll gradually get to cover everything in this sort of subject area. We’ll have some guest speakers coming in, people who are experts in their areas, and if people have questions that they want to ask us or topics that they want us to cover, then they can leave us a comment and then we’ll make sure that we can cover that as well.
DR GAV: Beautiful. Excellent. Well, thanks so much, Jason. I hope you guys are holding up well in Perth, don’t feel isolated, we’re just on the other end of a zoom call.
DR JAYSON: Yes. Thanks, Dr. Gav, look, I look forward to speaking to you again soon.
DR GAV: Ok, thanks Bye
DR JAYSON: Catch you later.